amy's been fielding questions from concerned friends about my rumored support for barack obama, so i'll lay it out there for everyone to read..:)1-intelligence and pragmatism. barack's campaign has been a model of intelligent and measured decisions. he carefully and steadily guided his campaign and brought down the clinton political juggernaut. he did it smartly, by identifying weaknesses in the enemy and attacking in measured doses without bravado or stupidity.
barack is fluent about the problems americans face. the problems we face are enormous and multi-faceted. barack consistently lays forth workable solutions where mccain lays out one-liners or reactions to barack's plans.
2-republicans failed healthcare. like most physicians, i am for universal coverage. i hate basing my prognosis for a condition on the insurance coverage of a patient. wholesale reform is needed and 8 years of bush has made things worse. mccain gives token thoughts on tax deductions and 'deregulation', but it feels too much like what bush has already tried...a lot of nothing.
sure, i'm scared that barack will place too much power in the hands of bureaucrats and that healthcare will go down in flames like social security is. however, i think something needs to be done sooner than later or there will be mutiny in the general public and that mutiny will lead to much more drastic and damaging plans than what barack already proposes. the devil is in the details, and mccain is not a details kind of guy.
3-international relations. mccain talks as if foreign policy is his strong point, but this is where he is most scary. barack's visit to germany a month back bordered on inspiring. i believe america holds an important moral ground on the world stage. bush has tarnished that in large part because he doesn't know how to talk to people coherently. barack's willingness and ability to inspire through rhetoric and find common ground is just what america needs. can you imagine the smugness mccain displays in public during the debates playing out over late-night negotiations with russia's new prime minister, or with iran's current president?
4-american men and women are dying. mccain is looking for any excuse possible to stay in iraq. any setback and he'll be ramping up our involvement in the name of victory. his rhetoric on this subject frightens me. we need to responsibly hand over control of iraq to iraqi's. sure, let's avoid a power vacuum, but let's get out as quickly and responsibly as possible.
5-no more leadership vacuum...please. the last two weeks have seen two men fumble and bumble their way to delays in the financial rescue of our country. bush gave one heady speech over the radio to the public that was unconvincing and mccain 'suspended' his campaign to push himself into the spotlight that ultimately derailed delicate negotiations. we needed a leader to spell out the gravity of the problem before us. we needed someone to convince the american people to act swiftly and courageously in supporting their congressman on passage of a financial rescue that may have been too little too late in stopping a credit freeze that may see us fall into the worst economic times the country has seen since the great depression.
there is something to be said for a man (or woman) who inspires confidence and can communicate effectively with those he leads.
6-a fiscally divided america. the ever widening income gap between the haves and have-nots in america is shameful. i'm not talking about taking from the rich and giving to the poor. i'm talking about enriching the poor and the middle classes and thereby lifting all. call it trickle-up economics if you will. over the last 50 years the wage gap has increased the most under republican leadership. it will cause unrest and hatred in the country. barack speaks to this and it's important.
7-i am a believing mormon. here's the clincher for many of you reading this blog. can a believing mormon vote democrat? doesn't barack support proposals that the prophet has spoken against? yes and no.
first off: president faust was a democrat. barack does not support gay marriage.
secondly: even on issues that barack doesn't line up with thomas monson's views, that's okay!!! i believe it is counterproductive for a religion to align itself solely with one party. mormonism clearly does not align itself with one party. contrary to cultural mormon thought--you can vote however and for whomever you want and still hold a calling, be a bishop, a member of the first presidency and take the sacrament. please don't be held hostage by a few issues and abrogate your responsibility to truly judge the candidates by their whole message.
there you have it.
59 comments:
Paul,
good post. It's pretty clear to me that Obama is by far the superior choice. I thought the letter from the first presidency was very interesting. It stated that both political parties teach principles of the gospel. It also stated that it is our responsibility to make informed choices on the candidate that will best lead our country. I'm really getting sick of people saying that they don't feel like Obama is good for our country, and have no idea about why he isn't good for our country. I'm fine with people supporting McCain, there are some good reasons to vote for him. I just don't by the "because the spirit told me to vote for him approach." The first presidency and the scriptures state that the spirit does not work in this matter. The spirit testifies of truth and Christ. Neither candidate is Christ, and neither has the "complete" truth. So contrary to what some may think, the spirit does not work this way. Also, why is our church looking the other way with McCain's morality? He has a wife that waits for him all throughout Vietnam. In his forties, he hooks up with Cindy (In her twenties) invites her to meet him and a hotel bar, and the rest is obvious. All while still being married to this woman who stuck it out with him through some difficult times. where is the outrage. If a man in his forties is going after one of my daughters in her twenties, I would be pissed. I don't understand how McCain seems to be grabbing the moral values, better character card. Anyways, thanks for your posts.
Please come to Provo and tell that to my neighborhood.
Pragmatic and Smart – I’m not taking that away from him. He’s certainly thoughtful. I think McCain and Pailin are smarter than they’re getting credit for too. Based on their records though, Obama might have a better edge in communicating and building relationships among the American Public and among some foreign powers. But I think McCain has a better history of building support and relationships within Washington.
Universal Health Care vs. 5,000 tax credit – I actually like both plans. If I had to pick between the two, I’d favor McCain’s right now. I appreciate your position as a doctor Paul, but as an insurance provider (I do have some say in my city’s benefits packages) I sincerely want the workers within my organization to understand the real costs of medical treatment. I want them to shop around for the best quality health care and match it with the best price for quality. I want my employees (over 600 of them) to think more about preventative health care and try to take care of their bodies. More than anything, I wish they’d stop smoking and exercise a little. With McCain’s $5,000 credit for health care, we would encourage our employees to open Health Savings Accounts which would open their eyes to the real costs while at the same time it would guard against catastrophic illness and injury. I’m not opposed to Barack’s plan, but right now, I favor the other.
International Relations – No strong opinions here.
Iraq – I don’t want to see us there forever, but I don’t want a quick exit just to fulfill a campaign promise. Some call this another Vietnam, but I see a distinct difference in that the terrorists we’re fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan will regroup and attack us again if we leave the wrong way where as North Vietnamese were not going to bring the war back to us. I do think, however, that our strategies and plans need to be rethought for better results.
No More Power Vacuum – It’s not very clear which reports are accurate in the financial meetings. One side says McCain derailed it. The other side says he was set up. But the big point, to me, is that the financial “rescue package” probably shouldn’t have gone through at all. I’m not convinced of the credit freeze plunging us into a Great Depression and I see very little to boost my confidence that poor lending practices will be regulated well. I read that whole bill (or 3 bills if we want to be accurate). The powers given to the treasury department are far reaching and scary. Their version of regulation gives them the legal authority to mandate banks to make bad loans in addition to buying bad debts of a variety of natures. I am predicting this will make the problem worse, not better. The problem for McCain is that he supported the same thing. They’re probably both wrong.
To some he inspires confidence. Others are scared to death of this guy whether or not they are well justified in their fears.
You’re Mormon Point is dead on. I am a registered Democrat although I vote pretty evenly between parties at all levels of elections.
In the end, I will probably vote for McCain this time around, mostly because I want opposition in all things or a balance between the legislative and executive branches of government.
There are a lot of you commenting in here that I would love to see run for office one day (at least on the local level) or get involved in grass roots political meetings. You learn a lot more there than you ever will from watching national media coverage of politics.
paul: please let me say amen to all your comments.
chris: your reason for supporting mccain would make sense to me if the democrats were to get more than 60 seats in the senate, but it doesn't look like they will. by the way, where do you live?
North Carolina
Paul,
I appreciate your comments. I am certainly not as informed as you, but I agree with you. The more I try to learn about Mccain to give him a chance, the less I want to vote for him. So, unless he can somehow change his cocky know-it-all attitude and disprespect for people then my vote is for obama.
Paul,
Good post, my thoughts on each area you mentioned are similar.
Living in a mormon bubble here, it is interesting the reaction we get when we tell people that we are going to vote for obama. Trudy said that one day at a play date she had with Kaden and some of our friends. They thought she was joking and then were floored when she said she was serious. They looked at her like she was an apostate.
Darin
oh my chris. north carolina, huh? well then, we need your vote for obama. what can we do to get you there? please lay out your top three concerns with obama, and hopefully we can help alleviate said concerns.
Issue 1 - Health Care
Although I'm not completely oposed to a government provided health plan, I think Obama's plan erodes private sector options. As an employer in the current economic conditions, paying Obama's health tax alternative instead of providing health coverage for our employees is cheaper. That would probably be the case for most employers. That tax money along with other government sudsidies will undercut private health care options. It also does nothing to make individuals more responsible consumers of health care, nor (in many cases) does it encourage individuals to be better stewards of their own bodies. That makes the government provided health care the single provider sooner than later.
McCain's plan to give us a $5,000 tax credit interests me a lot. I like it because it makes the individual or family responsible for health care shopping. If someone likes one health plan over another after they look at price and coverage, they can pick that plan. The $5,000 would then be sent to that insurance provider and if there is an amount left over (as there would be in my case) we get to put it into a Health Savings Account - and I LOVE Health Savings Accounts. This idea is NEW. While I have high hopes for it, I don't know if it will all work out the way I want it to, but it's worth a try over the next 4 years (after which I don't believe McCain would be president anyway). If it is not as successful, there will always be another Democrat presidential candidate ready with a government provided health plan in the future.
Issue 2 - War on Terror
I don't believe that McCain is looking for any excuse available to stay in Iraq. I do believe that U.S. strategies before the "surge" were not well thought out and we scaled back in Afghanistan too soon, thus a change is was necessary. We do need to win in the Middle East region. I don't think I'm fear mongering here when I say that failure in the region will cost us more money and lives in the future. But the surge is working, Iraq is preparing for provincial elections this year and a national election next year, and the security forces have made big improvements. Despite what he has been accused of, McCain won't stay in Iraq for 100 years - he can't. An end is coming sooner than later.
I worry about Obama withdrawing troops too quickly as he gets pressured by congress and very vocal members from the far left. I don't think he wants to withdraw too quickly, but I do worry that he might do it.
thanks all for you thoughtful comments to this point. i'm surprised no one has called me an apostate yet...
ivan: mccain is certainly not the more moral man of the two candidates...that's fer dang sure.
carolina: set it up...i'll come.
chris: health care is a wash. in most instances i am fiscally conservative and it is in this arena that barack scares me the most.
the tax credit thing seems hokey to me. there are too many reasonably intelligent people out there that won't take the time to figure it out and take advantage of it. i see it doing little to decreased the number of uninsured...it would probably increase the number as employers leave people more and more on their own for health care coverage...
stevie: agreed. christopher needs to be convinced since he lives in a 'relevant' state...unlike utah and california.
mikey: you go :)
darin: i love the story about the playgroup's reaction to trudy...priceless.
when i hear mccain's voice get strained and high pitched about his foreign policy i think of trigger in disney's 'robin hood'
Issue 3 - The Economy
Talk about playing to America's fears (after previous politicians and financial institutions played with America's hopes). I hear Obama in debates and interviews claiming that we are in an almost unsurmountable economic crisis and we have to do something now. Then he goes on to blame Bush and the Republicans for the whole problem. His description of the situation has many believing they will be living in a van down by the river within the year. Then I hear him tell reporters that we have to keep a level head and the worst thing we can do right now is to panic and raise fears. Then I hear him raising fears again. Then back again with the "keep calm" mantra. I would be down right angry at Obama for this except McCain is doing the same thing.
The bailout (especially that bailout) was not the answer to the current situation. There was a regulation problem, a lending problem, and a bad forecasting problem, all of which began back in the early 90s. The national drive to get Americans into affordable housing was taken up by House and Senate members from both parties. Deregulation of financial institutions was supported by both parties. Freddy Mac and Fanie Mae went nuts buying up bad mortgages. Word spreads through lending institutions and they see their opportunity to make tons of money through bad loans because they could count on the government backed Fannie and Freddy to take the bad debt off their books. When the problems were brought up in 2004, 2005, and 2006, the Democrats were adament that Fannie and Freddy were solvent, had no problems, and should be left alone. Meanwhile the Republicans were unwilling to regulate financial institutions outside of Fannie and Freddy to force higher qualifications for loan applicants. The housing market crumbles. That would have been bad enough with its ripple effects through the rest of the economy. But add on top of that the retirement of the Baby Boomer generation which no one is talking about. Most of the Baby Boomers have now passed through their peak earning and spending years and many have already retired. That means less American money flowing around in the economy and fewer experienced workers to fill key upper level jobs. It is now hitting businesses from all sectors. The Clintons enjoyed the economic benefits of the Baby Boomers moving into their peak earning and spending years, and maybe that gave the artificial impression that the economy would remain strong due to certain Washington economic policies. Oops!
When will the economy get better? It probably won't really happen until the eco-boomers (Generation Y) enter into their peak earning and spending years. Allowing increased immigration might be another solution, but I haven't really thought that one through yet. This issue is huge for me, but neither candidate gets my support here because I don't think either of them really understand the situation well. Obama pushes too hard on the affordable housing side while McCain has historically supported deregulation of financial institutions.
Stay out of debt everybody. And live within your means.
chris.
i didn't have time to read through everything you wrote. but i will try to get back to it another time.
but let me offer you this:
a deal. a compromise.
i'll cast your vote for mccain, if you'll cast my vote for me for obama.
sound reasonable?
Paul, I like your comments so much I want to post them to my blog. You couldn't have said anything better, on every issue that we feel strongly about. It's refreshing to see that you share our opinion.
I'll look for your permission, but can I give you the credit and include your thorough thoughts on our blog for all our concerned Philly Mormon friends, who think we're going apostate?
Love, Jenny and Nate Richards
richards.jenny@gmail.com
i don't think you're apostate jenny. and you may use any words you please :)
The link between Mormons and the Republican Party is a relatively recent phenomenon. In fact, Mormons used to be very anti-Republican when the party carried the banner of fighting "the twin relics of barbarism—slavery and polygamy". Between 1917 and 1985, 65% of Utah's governors were Democrats. But the state hasn't seen one since.
I think the cause that moved many Mormons from Democratic Party supporters to Republican Party supporters came largely from social issues like abortion. This is really when the "religious right" came into being. I personally find it ironic how tightly most Mormons hold to the Republican Party despite the way the evangelicals in the party think about the Mormons.
kendall: agreed.
jenny: hi!!
I thought this friend's blog post on the McCain health care plan was interesting and relevant to some of this discussion.
Chris,
Disagree with you the the bailout was not necessary, it was. Credit is the lifeblood of the economy and the credit markets are frozen. The "bailout" is designed to get those flowing again. If you get a blood clot and don't unclot it, you die. Very similary with the economy and credit. The first bill they tried to pass had some flaws, but the one that actually passed isn't nearly as bad as people think or the media spins it.
Darin
darin: agreed.
Prediction,
Obama wins the popular vote with at least 60%, it's obvious he won't win Utah but I think he will shock people with at least a 40% showing.
Also, with healthcare, I love the HSA as well but I don't think it will decrease the numbers of uninsured, and the only issue I have with it is what do we do with those who have chronic disease or illness?
ivan: i disagree with you. there is no way that obama will ever come close to a 40% showing in utah. i predict he wins the national vote by a slim margin (52-46) but landslides the electoral vote. utah, though? there is no way obama has a chance of putting up those kind of numbers...
I'm not sure as to why all the Mormon comments. I guess I live in a less judgmental neighborhood? I'd vote for a Democrat if I felt like he was the best candidate. Since I'm not too keen on either candidate this round, maybe I will write you in Paul, oh wait, then I might as well vote Obama. :) And to Ivan- this is quoted from the First Presidency letter- "Therefore, in this election year, we urge you to register to vote, to study the issues and candidates carefully and prayerfully, and then to vote for and actively support those you believe will most nearly carry out your ideas of good government." You can find the full letter on lds.org in the newsroom. Why would our prophet tell us to prayerfully study each candidate and the issues if the spirit won't help us out on who we believe will do the best job? What would be the point of doing it prayerfully? I totally disagree with you on that one. And Jared said nice political speech Paul. (Seriously).
How are you doing there Amy? How do you like your family blog turning into a political forum? Hope you are doing well. Your children are beautiful.
Boy... I haven't been on here forever. The kiddos and I were out of town for a couple of weeks, and now we get Paul's mom for a few days, then will be joined by his dad and brother. Fun times.
Political discussions around friends and family are fun right now. I'm still undecided... and I hoped the debates would help me work it all out. But all they seem to give are soundbites and generalities. The details on records are meant to manipulate and details on policies are incomplete.
It all seems like such a game simply to win votes instead of fully disclosing what kind of president/vp they would be. Disheartening if you ask me. I don't know what I expected... but it all seems pretty cloudy, still.
Amy, I'm so glad you all made it safely. It was so wonderful sharing some time with you this past week and discussing the "cloudy" outlook. I look forward to more conversations. :)
galo fab 5,
Thanks for pulling up the quote from the First Pres. As I review my first comment on this post it does look like I'm totally disregarding the spirit with our political decisions. So my first comment was not thought out very well. I think the spirit can help us with our political decisions if we do as the prophet has told us, to study the issues and candidates carefully and prayerfully. I've heard a couple people say that they feel that Obama is bad for our country and won't say why. So my bad on that comment and thanks for calling me on it.
Stephen,
I'm still standing by the prediction, I'll probably look really stupid for it but it makes blogging kind of fun. Your prediction is much more accurate, and if I was a betting man, I'd have to put money on your prediction.
ivan and kellie: agreed.
look how nice everyone is on our blog when most of us are agreeing with peter and stephen..:)
kellie: i think a point that ivan was trying to make and that i agree with is that many people's political views are not arrived at through prayer. it's too tempting to pick a side quickly based on one or two issues that are very visible and are in line with the majority opinion in certain neighborhoods. on closer look however, there are myriad 'moral issues' espoused by both candidates and sides. to be very vocal about prophecies from revelation forecasting obama's election to office as a sign of evil times (a very real email making the rounds in my parent's ward) is silly, counterproductive and not arrived at through the spirit...
so both of you have made good points. the lord can be a part of our decision. religious fundamentalism can lead to extremes as groupthink allows for frenzied and unrealistic ideas...leading the to idea that too much religion in politics may not be a good thing.
i'm still waiting for chris to take me up on my vote-swap proposal.
paul.
we can both be very agreeable, when you agree with us. :)
then again, we haven't heard from matt or gabrielle on this thread yet either. maybe i spoke too soon.
oh yeah. for once, i agreed with something bill kristol said. can you believe that? i'm not at home and hate PC's or i'd post a link to his latest editorial in the nytimes about how mccain should turn around his campaign. i.e. scrap the campaign. i figure the readers on this blog are savvy enough to google the article. good read. good ideas. i can't believe i'm endorsing bill kristol...
My concern, Paul, is that you are so focused on defending or explaining your decision, that any and all talk of BYU football has slipped through the cracks. Very dissapointing.
I watched the debate. McCain is a moron and Obama is promoting class warfare. I admit that I found myself agreeing that his (Obama's) policies would have an immediate positive impact on me financially (as I understand it), but at what cost? What will be the unintended consequences by giving more power to a blundering and wasteful government? This year is a hard one for me.
IMHO, nothing is more wasteful than 10 billion a month in iraq. especially run on a chinese credit line.
bush/mccain have sold us out. and by us, i mean, good old fashion fiscally conservative republicans. bush has expanded the government size, number of bureaucracies, and monetary largess (deficit), all while cutting revenues streams in the most irresponsible manner of any recent administration.
i have yet to hear mccain pronounce any departure from such wasteful governance. earmarks don't count. they are too little a part of the budget at whole. and buying up bad housing debt sounds even worse and more irresponsible.
i def think obama is a safer bet for all of us in regards to the financial health of the country. but i guess that opinion shouldn't be that surprising.
wow. this is all so agreeable. i'm not sure how to take it.
matt: i disagree that obama is promoting class warfare. we need to get beyond such divisive terms. obama is trying to build the economy from the bottom up. but let's be serious: he is not trying to force any sort of war between classes. that term is antiquated and no longer applies in this political day and age.
secondly, peter: i agree that kristol is right about scrapping mccain's campaign people. Although, at the same time I think kristol is trying to create an excuse for mccain (i.e. my campaign forced me to be dishonest, nasty, mean, and boring). mccain needs to take full responsibility for his ugly campaigning and his lack to clamp down on his campaign machinery is indicative of the type of leader he will be.
thirdly Kellie, just vote for obama already. seriously. if you need any other reason, let me give you two words: 'sarah palin.'
lastly: oklahoma, florida, usc have all lost one game. byu is undefeated. why are they behind them in the rankings?
Petey: Vote swapping? Hmmm...You don't work for ACORN, do you? No, I guess if that were the case you would be offering me cigarettes to register to vote multiple times. No, I'm sure you're a fine person who just wants his vote to actually count for something gosh darn it.
Now, I like this blog and everything, but I kind of want to hear from a couple of you biggest Obama supporters. Paul, Petey, and Stephen, you are all more than welcome to call me and talk out the points in more detail. I also want to hear from Matt (mostly because I haven't heard from you for a while cuz). My number is 801-921-3985 or 828-323-7429.
-OR-
You can give me your phone numbers and tell me a good time to call you. If all goes well Petey, we might both get to vote for Obama and not have to swap votes at all.
Why is BYU behind Florida, USC, and Oklahoma? It's probably because any one of those teams pound BYU if they were to play. The Cougars barely took down an unimpressive University of Washington.
Actually, Chris, BYU handled Washington in every aspect of the game all game long (besides scoring). Don't count BYU out if they were to face a top SEC or Big 12 team. Talent isn't everything, and tomorrow will be very indicative of what kind of team BYU is when they face TCU on the road. The bottom line is that they have not lost a game in well over a year, so the debate over if they should be ranked above one-loss big-shots is still very valid in my mind. Besides, the MWC is no longer a cupcake conference (just ask the Pac-10). It is more competative this year than the Big East and the ACC, and was likely just as competative last year when BYU ran the table on it. Don't jump on the BCS bandwagon so easily, Chris.
Stephen,
I am just telling you my feelings when I watched the debate. Nobody told me to think "class warfare". I was nodding my head as Obama explained his plan thinking, "Man, if he can really turn things around and give me a tax break as well, that sounds pretty good to me!"
But where will the money come from? He has said that he will be taxing the wealthy more, but he would have to tax them a whole lot to make up for the programs he is proposing, or just follow W and take out more loans from China. What I would rather see is someone reform the tax system by closing all of the loopholes and making things transparent. At that point, I think it will become obvious who is not carrying their load and we can fix it. I am concerned about taxing success. I do want a stonger middle class.
Matt,
You're absolutely right on every BYU football point. I am wrong. I am wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, and I am filled with chagrin. Please accept my sincere apology.
"Class Warfare"
Maybe that word is antiquated. But call it "Class Envy", "Wealth Redistribution", or "Light Marxism", you can't deny that a lot of Barack's economic rhetoric (at least in his campaign) is pushing the issue of economic classes and specifically pitting the middle and lower classes against those unpatriotic rich people, none of whom pay their "fair" share of taxes.
matt: agreed. acc and big 12 over-rated. let smaller conferences into a playoff with fair seeding and let's settle it on the field. stop the strangle-hold espn/abc holds on college football for their own monetary gain.
byu handled washington, but let the score get away from them at the end.
byu may be better than many of those teams, but it's sad we'll never know because of the bcs greed killing true competition in the ncaa football arena.
stevie and matt: what a nice exchange. it warms my heart seeing you getting along...
chris: i'm glad to see you might come around...
chris: your last point agreed. stevie is definitely acting marxist (i believe we cross-commented in that last round of comments.)
obama's protectionist rhetoric is antiquated (not the class-warfare analogy that stevie threw out there to bait matty with)
paul.
agreed. obama's protectionist policies worry me too. i hope he is the pragmatist that i believe him to be and moves center from those policies.
who do you think is more excited for november 22nd (byu v. utah)?
all of you BYU nuts vs. me and emily (our wedding day for those that don't know me)
good question petey...
Sounds like I missed the best debate of this election cycle. My bad.
Pete: I don't know you, but happy birthday anyway.
Health Care: Obama's plan will lead to government being the single health care provider. It's not a "maybe". It will happen. McCain's plan does not strike me as gimicky like the rest of you claim.
BYU vs. TCU ... Brutal. I was hoping I'd be wrong on my 10-2 season prediction. Utah will be tough too.
I was just playing with Obama's magic calculater on his website. You just fill in some basic information about your income, tax filing status, and dependents. These tax brackets are caculated for my situation which is "head of household" with 3 dependents. Here is what came up:
Tax Brackets
$20,000
Obama Tax Savings $1120 vs.
McCain Tax Savings $0
$30,000
Obama Tax Savings $1119 vs.
McCain Tax Savings $285
$40,000
Obama Tax Savings $1053 vs.
McCain Tax Savings $1151
$50,000 - $75,000
Obama Tax Savings $500 vs.
McCain Tax Savings $405
$75,000 - $100,000
Obama Tax Savings $500 vs.
McCain Tax Savings $300
$100,000 - $150,000
Obama Tax Savings $500 vs.
McCain Tax Savings $300
$150,000 - $200,000
You will probably not get a tax cut under the Obama Plan vs. McCain Tax Savings $?
$200,000 - $250,000
You will probably not get a tax cut under the Obama Plan vs. McCain Tax Savings $?
$250,000 +
You will probably not get a tax cut under the Obama Plan vs. McCain Tax Savings $?
I should also note that I am in the $40k tax bracket, so strange as it may seem it turns out I get an extra $98 under McCain's plan.
I should also note that individuals in the $20K tax bracket already get a full tax refund, so they will recieve more money than they paid in taxes for the year.
It really is nice to see the absence of name-calling and personal attacks. So Christian of ya'll.
This last debate was so interesting to me. We were listening to it (and able to hear about 2/3 of it) on the radio on the way home from the beach. Then we got home and watched some of the recaps on TV... very different experience. To listen to the voices and what was actually being said was refreshing.
Coming home and watching was so distracting with smirks and grimaces popping up on every other split-screen. Pretty funny.
But I think after this debate I might be able to send in my absentee ballot next week after I research some of the state propositions, etc. a little more.
The real clencher for me? Health care. Does McCain really think that throwing $5000 per person will help the problem of our uninsured? Does he really think that the uninsured will actually use it for health insurance?
I'm extremely skeptical. I know a lot of people who *could* afford insurance if they wanted to make the personal budgeting sacrifice for it, and don't. Without having some kind of accountability attached to it, most people will find *better* things to do with $5000 than insure their own health.
And by the way... Paul and I have decided to be permanent absentee voters. So simple. So convenient. And with Paul's schedule... pretty much necessary. As long as we don't loose them. I highly recommend it.
McCain's plan requires the individual to select a health plan and a provider. The money is then sent directly to the provider and not to the individual. Just a little clarification.
Thanks, Chris. Guess I should do some more research :)
wait...amy...you're voting for barack? i'm so incredibly happy to hear it. seriously. i'm dancing around the room with joy.
Don't dance just yet, Stephen. I keep wavering.
I just don't know how comfortable I am with a democratic president and a democratic majority everywhere else, too. I hate thinking they will be able to pass anything they want without contest and the needed checks/balances.
Plus, my vote in California isn't going to change a thing... and I don't want the results to show that republicanism is dead and gone.
I think if he had a decent running mate I could vote for McCain a little easier. Ugh. Sarah Palin.
And McCain just feels so conniving and politically calculated. His "moves" seem to be crafted simply to get votes. He's scrambling and telling people what he thinks they want to hear.
But then I feel the same way about Obama. Except the conniving part. Obama? More cunning, I think. With a little more finesse.
It just all seems like a game. And we are the pawns.
So don't be dancing around the room yet, Stevie. I've tucked my ballot away for a little longer...
Amy, you describe my feelings pretty well. I'm not jumping up and down with excitement for either candidate. Barack is so much smoother, and even though I don't think his policies are great, he sells them so well. McCain can't present or communicate his policies well at all (maybe it's because he has spent a lot of time attacking Barack's policies and associations instead of promoting his own positions). Even though McCain's policies aren't great either, they're not nearly as bad as the majority of media outlets would have us believe. It sure makes it easy for Democrats though to be able to just point at Palin and say "you're voting for that?", and then half of the McCain base starts second guessing their vote.
Finally, your point on the Democrats controlling the legislative and executive branches is a very good one. It always seemed to me that things run better when those two branches are controlled by separate parties.
I know I'm late in the game on this thread, but I had to voice one idiotic comment from someone I know...
He said, "I'm not going to get health insurance because Adam-Ondi-Ahman will be here before I need it (apparently he hasn't read several very detailed prophecies that would suggest otherwise). And if anything happened to me, my family would take care of my wife and kids."
I want to cry at the stupidity and ignorance. Not to mention irresponsibility.
I am guessing as far as health care goes, the only way he would ever get it would be if it were given to him.... Poor, ignorant man... Any suggestions to help him overcome such stupidity?
By the way, love yours and Stephen's blogs!
thanks mark :)
maybe mandated health care would help the man..? facing a monetary penalty for not obtaining it is a great motivator...
So just a question. I'd love some feedback. What about those of us who own our own company, have medical history that causes health insurance companies to deny us coverage, yet we make just enough not to qualify for government insurance, and if we apply for ins. under the business, they write up the policies so high that how in the heck can we afford it unless we put it on a credit card every month or not eat, etc. I guess this mandated healthcare will be affordable for us middle class? Whose plan will benefit us most? I obviously need to research this more, please tell me how Obama will help my situation! Thank you!!! (And yes we do have a high deductable plan right now since we agreed some is better than none.)And no Stephen, I won't vote for Obama already. I may just vote for one of the independents. LOL.
kelli: mandated insurance would have subsidies depending on your income to help with deductible. by including all society into the risk pool then you should see premiums drop...
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